Team Tau, here is your Harkblog space. Feel free to take ownership of what is written in this post, but do use the comment section of this post for the discussion itself.
Below, you will find questions, ideas, or prompts that should stimulate your discussion for each reading unit. However, don’t feel tied to these prompts, ideas, or discussions. Instead, use them as a platform to reach depth in knowledge, understanding, and appreciation of the writer’s choices. Additionally, know that this is your space to work together to build ideas together.
Reading Section 1 & 2:
We’ll start with a relatively simple thought: “a good work of literature will teach you how to read it.” In what ways are you being taught to read Toni Morrison’s Beloved in the opening two sections? What are you being taught about the plot? The style of narration? The characters? What have you spotted in this opening section that you want to watch for as the novel develops?
Remember: we’re aiming to achieve depth in this discussion, so please focus your energies in that direction. That said, don’t be afraid to ask clarifying questions, as well, although know that this alone won’t show your engagement in the Harkblog.
readwriteredroom 
One thing that makes this book difficult to read is that it is hard to put yourself in the mindset of the characters. The way that they view things and think about their own lives is so different from peoples’ perspectives today. There are times when I’m reading where I can’t bring myself to understand their thought processes or reasoning.
That said, because Beloved’s narration is both anonymous and omniscient, it allows for the reader to see perspectives from all of the characters. These perspectives don’t seem to be all that censored either; we seem to be getting their genuine thoughts.
The narration also includes a lot a detail and description. This usually, however, tends to create even more question and mystery within the story. An example would be the vivid description of the tree on Sethe’s back. The reader finds out later what it actually is, a scar.
I’m also finding Beloved a really hard book to read. Part of the difficulty, I think, is the way people in that time spoke. I see this especially through Denver’s memories. She has a certain way of thinking that makes it hard to know what is going on. Also, the book likes to switch from present to past. I find myself reading something that I think is going on in the present, but it’s actually a memory.
I agree with you Margaux. It’s weird to be reading something about the present one minute and then realize the person talking, is talking about a memory or something that went on before. It’s actually really confusing and can be frustrating.
Zoe, I agree completely with the difficulty of putting yourself in the mindset of the characters. It’s really driving me mad. Usually when I read a book, I try to attach myself to one of the characters based on a common thread between myself and the character, and try to relate to the rest of the characters based on that. But this is just proving impossible with this book!
I like the rapidly shifting perspectives. It makes the book interesting to follow, and I try really hard to pay attention. Some of the stuff is super indirect though, which is really confusing. Like a perfect example is when Sethe and Paul D have sex, but Toni Morrison says “It was over…”
Until Joe said it in class today, I had thought the two of them were making out, having a grand old time, and then were like “Meh, maybe not.” Some of the stuff she says makes it hard to distinguish what was going on.
And I’d say that she intentionally complicates her pronouns to accomplish this. So, for that particular quotation (“It was over”), we’re not entirely sure what noun that ‘it’ replaces.
That’s not the only place in the text where we become confused by pronouns (however intentional this confusion is). What’s another one? How might that confusion be productive?
I came across another obscure use of ‘it.’ After Paul D and Sethe’s fight on page 55 (near the bottom), Paul D says, “leave it to me. Se how it goes.” Sethe replies that she’s willing to leave “som of it.”
The reader might infer that they’re talking about a certain responsibility, but it is very unclear as to what responsibility specifically. All the reader knows is that Sethe is putting “some” sort of trust in Paul D.
I kind of think that, after what we discussed in class, I’m still not sure what the use of the word “it” represents, but I do think that it might be related to when we talked in class about how she likes to write with lots of complexity, and she likes to make the reader work for understanding. The fact that she doesn’t choose to clarify, I think, helps to show that she’s looking to the reader to understand. The whole book is complex like this; maybe us working for the understanding helps us actually understand the complexities and specifics of a situation described in the book better than if we’d just been served up the answers on a silver platter.
This book is very different from the books we have read in English class before. The information given is in a kind of random order (but still organized in some ways), and I got really confused at the first time. It taught me that sometimes we need to think in a different way if we cannot understand what the text means, and this way we can more likely think of what the writer wants to tell us. Also, the discussion we had during class yesterday was really helpful for me to understand the text, so I think we can discuss with others while reading a book in order to understand it better.
Can I ask if you guys actually agree that a good work of literature will teach you to read itself? I’m trying to think of ways that it might, but honestly, I don’t think I necessarily agree 100% of the time. Opinions?
I don’t 100% agree it, either. When I first read the book, I was confused about the time changing and the perspectives changing. I did not know what was the significance of the author doing so. However, when I came to the class discussion, people shared their opinions of the text itself which made it more clear to me. Therefore, reading itself does not teach me how to read, but listening to others interpretation makes it more clear to me.
Let me pull back on that original statement, actually: one could argue that any experience teaches you how to navigate through it. (So, ‘bad’ pieces of literature teach you how to read them, as well. Or, throw an alien into a dodgeball game and he’ll eventually understand the rules).
So, to work with what Maggie says, BELOVED begins with relatively rapid perspective shifts, and the reader is immediately confused by this. Then, the text seems to pull back on the speed with which the perspective changes. So, the reader adjusts to the perspective shifts (or, adjusts to accept the confusion or complexity of those shifts), and you begin to accept that you will be confused.
Some texts become clearer as you continue to read (you get used to characters, events, and time periods), and some texts just normalize a style or feeling (however perplexed you continue to be about what’s going on and need class discussion!).
Or maybe not?
I agree with you, Zoe and Alexa, that it is hard to relate ourselves to the characters in the book. I also find the changing perspectives strategy distracting. I always lost track of whose perspective Toni Morrison was using, making me very confusing when I read the book. Not only did this constant change of perspectives made this book very difficult to read, the content of this book was also hard to understand. I did not know that Halle and Sethe were having sex in the cornfield until the class discussion yesterday. When I reread the chapter, I still don’t really see how readers could know that.
so I have a question about the symbol of “tree” this appears many times in the text, for example, Sethe’s scar, and also the forests… what do you think the significance of mentioning many times about tree related things?
By using the image of a tree, I think Morrison is able to turn something ugly into something beautiful. Amy, the white girl that helps Sethe run away, is the first to mention that Sethe’s scars looks like a cherry tree. This characterizes Amy. She is able to take someone born from sadness and turn it into a beautiful cherry tree.
I agree with you Margaux. I feel another piece of evidence where Amy takes someone born from sadness and turns it into something beautiful is when she straps Denver to Sethe and tells her that she’ll have to be the one to tell Denver who brought her into the world. Sethe thinks she’s going to die but with that comment Amy puts a positive spin on it saying that she and her baby will live because Sethe will tell her baby the story of who brought her into the world.
Margaux, I totally agree with you, but I want to play devil’s advocate, because let’s face it. That’s fun.
Trees aren’t necessarily viewed as beautiful to everyone, and scars aren’t always viewed as ugly. I’ve seen these little strawberry shaped scars from burns that are red and kind of cute, when you really think about it. This tree that Sethe has is in no way cute, but maybe it’s not exactly ugly either.
Ooh. Keep going, Team Tau! Tracking trees might be an interesting approach for what’s to come. Let’s be sure to continually focus particular passages in the text.
Actually, to go off your point Alexa, I found a place in the text where trees are seen in a negative light. On page 101 Morrison writes,”…refurbished the faces of Howard and Bulgar and kept them whole in the world because in her dreams she way only their parts in trees.” Here, trees are connected to death and hanging. It will be interesting to see how people’s interpretation of trees/ forests change throughout the book.
Nice observation Margaux! I feel like there are more than one perspectives to look at the significance of trees. Just as in the book, the perspectives of the characters alter a lot. Therefore, it is also really interesting to see how different characters value the significance of tree.
For example : on p133, Paul D, when he is escaping and traveling around, the book mentions that he is “guided by the blossoming plums”. It shows that to Paul D, the tree represents hope and guidance.
To keep going with the topic of trees, I find it really interesting that Denver’s secret hideaway is essentially a room in the forest made by trees/shrubs. This place acts as as a safe haven for her, where she can escape reality. Like, Brother (the tree that Paul D remembers back at Sweet Home), these trees are act as someone or something to confide in.
I’ve noticed that Sethe has these “flashbacks” or memories.. and they aren’t in chronological order. I think this is what makes the book hard to follow. I also didn’t realize exactly what kind of relationship Paul D and Sethe have. Paul D us much more committed than I had initially thought. Their day at the colored people fair changed my opinion of Paul D. I though that was really special. Also, I like that the “shadow” of them holding hands lead the way on their way home.
The shadows holding hands also caught my attention. Another mention of shadow only a few pages after that is rather contrasting. On page 68 Sethe and Beloved’s shadows “clashed and crossed on the ceiling like black swords.” It’s interesting that Morrison chooses a hostile description even though there is zero animosity between the two characters at this moment.
Great spot here, Zoe. Is there a difference in perspective (or, point-of-view) in these two particular moments? Or is it from the same third/limited?
Answering Joe’s question below, I think that the shadow reference on page 68 is in Beloved’s perspective. There are a few sentences after the shadow quote in the paragraph that seem to suggest this: “surrendering to the habit, Beloved began inching down B Road further and further…it was as though every afternoon she doubted anew the older woman’s return.”
As for the holding hands shadow (p. 56) it’s in Sethe’s perspective, and the same reference on p. 59 was in Denver’s point of view.
Maybe we can read into Beloved’s intentions of coming into Sethe’s home and family. Is she trying to break apart the family, hurt them in some way? Or maybe it just foreshadows and shows a break of harmony in the family due to Beloved’s presence?
Any other ideas?
You’re right, Megan: the resistance to clear chronology makes the text challenging to track. Any suggestions for how Team Tau could get a better grasp on this? (come to think of it, these Harkblogs also have the same challenge!)
I agree with everyone that the book is very difficult to read, but as I keep reading through things start to make sense, and I start to understand the story more. Also, How each characters start to strongly related to each other in the past and present.
The idea of the tree, I think it very significant in the story because it mentions a lot in the book like things that happen under the tree with Paul D and his friends. Also, in the forest when Sethes tries to escape, and Sethe’s back represents a kind of tree. I agree with Alexis that the tree is not ugly or cute, but it depends on how the characters’ view. For Paul D as he keep looking at Sethe’s back, he realize from the beautiful view, becoming just a back with a scars. However, when Amy saw her back she thinks of it as a beautiful tree. However, I think that Amy views the tree as a beautiful tree just because she wants to make Sethe feel better because Sethes is weak at that time. Also, I think a tree symbolizes as a life, and it is like Sethe’s life. The scars that looks like a tree actually represents as Sethe’s sad life and her curiosity about her husband and her sons that will never go away because Sethe still cannot forget about her painful past.
Continuing on with the tree idea, I think alexa’s point is valid. I think that a tree can be beautiful in a sense but can also be not very appealing. I think these contrasting ideas go along with Sethe’s scars. I agree with what people are saying because I think with every beautiful thing there is something ugly that comes along with it.
I think it’s also significant that the tree scar is on Sethe’s back. As Pin said, it represents her life and. She is constantly trying to avoid her past, which seems possible because the scar is behind her, she can’t actually see it. At the same time though, it’s always at her back, literally and metaphorically, following her and weighing her down. She can’t escape the past even though that seems to be what she wants most.
Things To Track With Paul D
• Involvement with music/songs
• Opinion of Beloved
• Perspective of Sethe
• Perspective of Denver
• Role in the family
Other things discussed in class:
Things To Track With Sethe
• Feeling towards the house
• Feeling towards the past and her memories
o Dealing with new information on her past
• Role as a mother
• Relationships with Paul D and Beloved
Things To Track With Denver
• How she works with Beloved
• Secret tree hideaway (for all character- each have their special spaces)
• Hostility
o How and when that occurs
• Relationships with Paul D, Sethe, Beloved
For tracking in our class we had:
For Paul D:
-his music
-jealousy
-aggression (what sets him off)
-memories
For Denver:
– Denver and Beloved’s relationship (Denver keeps trying to get some type of emotion out of Beloved)
For Sethe:
-traveling by foot (why is she moving from place to place)
-this can also be tracked in other characters for example Denver can’t travel very far by foot. How does that affect her and what does it show?
I think another thing to following in the book is how nature effects Paul D. The earthquake in the beginning of the story causes him rage, Brother the tree plays a significant role in his life, and the rain, which is repeated multiple times on page 130, almost causes him death. It makes me wonder how else nature will play a role in Paul D’s life throughout the book.
To answer the question of nature playing a role in Paul D’s life, page 132-133, The quotes on “Follow the tree flowers, only the tree flowers, you will be where you want to be when they are gone”, seems relevant to what Paris is saying. It shows that one perspective of nature plays a guiding role for Paul D.
I think that caring for Beloved is something that Denver really enjoys doing. Earlier in the book Morrison writes about how it infuriates Denver when Paul D says that he knew her father well. Denver feels like she doesn’t really have anyone she has a strong connection with. The person she’s closest to is Beloved and even the spirit of Beloved tell her that all the wants is their mother. However, I do think that once Beloved is there and sick taking care of her gives Denver a sense of fulfillment. For example, on page 65 Sethe tries to give Denver advice and she will not accept it.
I agree with your comment about Denver caring about Beloved, Megan, but I’m not exactly sure what it means. It’s one thing for us to say that she seems closest to Beloved because it gives her a sense of fulfillment, but I feel like this easily has a stronger connection to the book than that. Maybe we can draw some kinds of similarities or differences between Beloved – similarities, maybe, because then it could show that Denver liked caring for Beloved because Beloved is similar to her/reminds her of herself. Or maybe it’s because she’s radically different. I just think it differs from Denver’s usual behavior, so it’s interesting.
Grace, I agree with you in saying that the relationship between Denver and Beloved is strange. I’m not sure what kind of strange, but it’s definitely strange. Although, I think Denver’s strong relationship with Beloved is not because she sees Beloved as another version/similar to herself, but she sees Beloved as the sister she never got to have. Beloved is the word on the baby’s gravestone, and this woman is incredibly attached to Sethe. She watches her all the time, and has her tell stories. I think the relationship with Denver and Beloved is less than a relationship with another part of oneself and more of a relationship between sisters.
At first I was also really confused about Denver and Beloved’s strange relationship so I decided to track it throughout the book. I found my answer on page 123 when Morrison writes, “It took a man, Paul D, to shout [the ghost] off.. Denver preferred the venomous baby to him any day… Beloved was hers.” I think Denver cares so much for Beloved because Beloved is the only thing Denver thinks is truly hers. All Denver wants to do is love another person, and she thinks that Beloved is the only one left that she can care for. This also explains her spite towards Paul D. I think Denver thinks he took Sethe and the ghost, the two things Denver had to love, away.
Cool Margaux, thats was basically what I was getting at in my comment above. Maybe I just didn’t phrase it in a very effective way.
Paul D
• Track reaction towards Beloved
• Interactions with Denver
• Track how Paul D is compared to Halle
• How Paul D brings up Halle
• What Paul D and Sethe fight about
• How Paul D interacts with the house
• How Paul D interacts with the family dynamics
• What is Paul D’s connection to his journey
I think one difference that causes Paul D and Sethe to have arguments is because how they view their future. Paul D seems to be determined and looking forward to his future with Sethe. However, in the other hand, Sethe is still caught up with the past and she cannot relate to what Paul D is expecting for the future.
Tracking Denver:
The relationship between Denver and Sethe is not open
Paul D knows more about Sethe than Dernver does
Denver is sad because shes the one who can communicate with Beloved but Beloved just wants their mom
Afraid Paul D will take her mom away
Warms up to Paul D
Denver is jealous because she thinks she knows more
I think that the tree gives Sethe Character. It says so much in so little. From the scar we know that she was beaten, yet she survived. In my opinion she acts very nonchalant about her abuse. I think she’s think- skinned (in a metaphorical sense no pun intended) and underplays violence, maybe because she doesn’t like to attract attention to herself or that is the way she is, numb to the world. What caused her to be like this?She has had violence in her life. What other forms of violence has she faced? How does Sethe respond to violence?
Megan, I agree with the idea that the tree gives her character. I think because Paul D had the tree back at Sweet Home that he would talk to and personify, the tree gives Sethe some personality. That being said, I disagree with you on the thin-skinned part. I think if she was thin-skinned she’d need someone to constantly be reassuring her that her scars are important or that they make her beautiful. I think instead she took the experiences that she was dealt and she used them as fuel to fire up her soul and give her the drive to leave Sweet Home and do all these things as a free woman.
that was supposed to be thick* skinned
I agree with Alexa in saying that Sethe took the experiences that she went through and used them in a way to motivate herself. I have a question and I don’t know exactly if it has been completely answered, but why do you think Morrison decided to add the part about the tree? Obviously, we think it has significance because we keep coming back to it. So instead of answering what does it mean, why did Morrison put the tree in Beloved?
So guys I’m loving all the ideas that everyone’s putting out there but I feel like this harkblog’s getting a little too crazy with so many different ideas. I think that maybe we should all come to a consensus about an idea in the book or even a specific moment to focus on so we’re all on the same page. Maybe we can start be designating what people should track in the book and see what they find. Then after people post something about their findings we can decide which we want to focus in on? What do you guys think? If so I’ll track nature and it’s relationship with Paul D.
I agree. We should focus on one or two ideas that all of us are interested in. I think it is a good way to deal with this book and make it easier to read.
Today in class we analyzed a passage about Denver’s increasing obsession for Beloved. Team Tau discussed some particular points which included Denver’s attitude change, the perception change on 142 and elements that reflected Denver’s love. Some of our questions were, Who is Ella? We discussed that she was a slave from evidence also found on pg 142. Another was, Why did Toni Morrison choose to bring her into the story in that part of the book. As a class we talked a lot about color and came to the consensus that Denver is willing to give up all color (or experiences) to get a faint color from Beloved.
Today in class, we talked a lot about the passage on 127-131 where we talk about the slaves as a single “they” entity and we talked about…
– Why are things repeated in this passage (it rained, they sang, etc)?
– Death/Life as male/female
-Significance of the numbers in this passage
– Okay, I don’t actually remember any other questions we had, but is anyone game for discussing the effect of the repetition in this passage? I’ll write down what I think in a min, but you guys can contribute too!
I think the way that “they sang” is repeated in the passage is helpful for establishing that feeling of a team/single entity/unity that we talked about saving their lives today in class. But out of all of what’s in this passage, why is “sang” the action that’s repeated?
Is it because when you sing, the people around you might not hear all the words you use when you sing and so singing might be their way of expressing their feelings without arousing a lot of attention from others?
I feel like singing is not only a way for the slaves to communicate and scolding their owners but also represents identity. They all come together and work together, which shows that the slaves consider themselves as a united group. It shows other side of their identity besides being slaves.
I don’t know whether the things I am going to say make sense. I noticed that most of the chapters in the book seem to be written from a main character point of view but when I came to page 174 to 178, these pages seemed not to be written from any one’s point of view. I don’t know whether Toni Morrison is doing this on purpose but these few pages just made me feel totally disconnected from the story.
Also, for those few pages, Morison does not use names much. I noticed she uses pronouns for Sethe and Baby Suggs a lot so sometimes I got lost of who she is talking about.
I think Morrison is trying to confuse the reader. When you make it to the end, you’ll understand it a little more, but I’m sure that was completely and utterly intentional.
I definitely haven’t made it to the end yet, but I agree with you, Alexa, because the whole book so far has seemed confusing, and I believe that the book is intentionally structured to be that way, maybe because the events Morrison is describing are terrible and unclear, or maybe because they are like memories, and the memories are fading, or maybe because the book is written in a manner that’s intended to be very familiar (which wouldn’t require as many names/clarifications).
Grace, let me warn you (and everyone else) it’s an extremely annoying ending, and the resolution is a TOTAL let down, but some stuff (like this point) is clarified.
Wow. I just finished the book yesterday, Alexa, and I have to be honest – I’m extremely confused, and I’m inclined to agree with you. I kind of understand the ending, but I think I’m right in saying that it requires you to suspend belief in order to get the most out of it, and I don’t think I’m really the only person who’s having difficulty doing that. I think it’s harder for me to engage with the ending because I didn’t find a way to engage in all the parts of the book, and the book is so complicated that I just couldn’t manage. I know not everyone here has finished the book yet, so I’m going to take my questions to the spoiler thread and see what everyone else is talking about in regards to the ending, but I’m wondering – for everyone else here, do you guys feel the same way about the ending, or did any of you like it/have a different opinion?